EM Opportunities In Hospitals

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This week we talk to Jody Carter about emergency management in the hospital setting. As you look for opportunities in emergency management don’t just stop at the local, county, and state. Hospital EMs are a growing segment of EM including HICS as a stand-alone system within a system.

Hi, and welcome to EM student. This is your host Irene Conforti, I am joined by Jody Carter. Hi, Jody, how are you?

Jody Carter 2:49 

Hello Irene, how are you? I’m excited we’re doing this.

Irene Conforti  2:53 

I am so happy to have you. As someone who has, you know, studied emergency management and gone through a lot of different training. I am so happy to have you on the program. If you would be so kind as to sort of introduce the work that you’re doing now. That would be great.

Jody Carter  3:12 

Sure, so my name is Jody Carter. I live in Little Rock, Arkansas. Full time I’m the emergency management coordinator for a series of hospitals across the state of Arkansas.

We’ve got a department of two we’ve got a training and exercise coordinator who works alongside me here in our emergency management office. Got my master’s in emergency management about

oh, mercy hasn’t been that long. It’s been almost 15 years I guess since I got my emergency management degree doesn’t seem like it was that long ago. Maybe it wasn’t maybe it was only 10 years ago you know Irene whenever we get to be this old it our memory fades

Irene Conforti  3:56 

Sure, well, it’s awesome that you got your degree, sort of as an emergency management is becoming a more formalized academic institution. I know I’m in the midst of getting my masters in emergency services administration from Cal State Long Beach, and I would love to hear about your experience, you know, getting your masters and how you studied and you know, what you’d like to have the students of emergency management, you know, know about, since you’ve gone through the process.

Jody Carter  4:31 

I now I’m going to have to look when did I get my degree I’m walking away from the microphone. This is

12 years ago, so got my master’s about 12 years ago. So

I attended a Jacksonville State University down in Alabama. And that’s where I got my masters. It’s an MS in emergency management.

I completed that program about 12 years ago, and absolutely loved my grad school experience, just love comparing it I got a bachelor’s degree in chemistry. I enjoyed it. chemistry was what I thought would help me get into medical school

I did not get into medical school. It’s one of the bigger blessings in my life, not getting into medical school. That while I was in my undergrad program, getting my chemistry degree, at night, I went to paramedic school, and I got a license as a paramedic when I got out of college, so I had both a degree in chemistry and a paramedic license. So, worked on an ambulance for a little while. Anyone who knows anything, buddy EMs knows that that’s a hard way to pay the rent and got a job as an analytical chemist did that for two and a half years while spending weekend still working on an ambulance. Somewhere in there join the Volunteer Fire Service, two and a half years, I finally accepted that I am not a good analytical chemist.

And from my EMS time and some of my firefighting time and some other people I knew and connections I had, I was able to start doing some contract work for Homeland Security. And I started doing some terrorism response training for a federal program from I did that from about oh three to about 11 somewhere in there. So about eight years or so I worked for a federally funded program, we taught local emergency responders what to do if terrorist attack with a specific focus on chemical biological nuclear weapons. Well, my chemistry work was in a laboratory working with chemical warfare agents. So, I had some firsthand experience with that and, and when it to do it some Homeland Security work, like I said, well, somewhere in there started getting a master’s in emergency management wanted to go to grad school, and thoroughly enjoyed my time studying at Jacksonville State. And the reason I enjoyed it so much was all my entire master’s degree program was focused on emergency management, you know, an undergrad, in addition, taking chemistry classes and math classes, I was taken art appreciation and

comparative politics of the Middle East and courses that, quite frankly, didn’t hold my attention. But in grad school, the entire program was related to emergency management. And I was still working for Homeland Security. And I was traveling some 200 nights a year. And one thing I enjoyed about my program at Jacksonville State was while they were brick and mortar university with physical campus, and my professors had physical offices, and I did go to see them a couple of times,

I was still able to travel because they offered the classes in an online modality. And back in oh four or five, there weren’t nearly as many universities offering an online option as Jacksonville State had back then, I was able to travel 200 nights a year, while at the same time doing grad school, from hotel rooms across the country. And I really enjoyed that and had a fantastic grad school experience Irene

Irene Conforti  8:24 

Yeah, that’s, that’s great to hear. I you know, I’m also during getting my degree in an online modality. And it’s, you know, great to hear that there have been good experiences in the past, I know it can be, you know, difficult at times, you know, you don’t have someone to, you know, go to the library with or you don’t have office hours to go and visit your professors. But it does sound like you had a great experience at Jacksonville. And, and that’s awesome. And especially that you’re able to use sort of your background in chemistry, also, you know, in, in your experience, your work experience, that’s also amazing. I think that there’s a lot of people, myself included, who have, you know, backgrounds like I did political science, for example, in, that can be a little bit difficult to be able to weave some of that education into sort of the more tangible, practical nature of the work of an emergency manager, I also want to be able to talk to you about your work in public health emergency management, which is, you know, really exciting. And, you know, I’d love to hear more about the work that you’re doing right now in Arkansas.

Jody Carter  9:37 

Oh, wonderful. So, you know, you mentioned the different backgrounds and, and I’ve got a philosophy on emergency management and, and my philosophy is that emergency management, I call it 5149. Okay, emergency management is 51% relationships, 49%, plans, procedures and protocols. And I think so much of what makes a successful emergency manager is that phone list that you have stored in whatever digital device it is that you’ve got, or in a Rolodex or whatever your whatever your contact,

storage method of choices, but I think an emergency manager, I think half of their value, I think, I think it’s 51% of our values in the relationships and, and, and who you know, and how you’re able to foster relationships and how you’re able to build trust. And, and I spent several years working for the Red Cross doing disaster management and, and they had a philosophy or maybe not philosophy, they had some verbiage that I really liked, and that I’ve used in my time after working there. And they talk about blue skies and gray skies. And so much of what we do in blue skies, blue sky times, and blue-sky times are when everything’s normal, and when we’re not in disaster mode. And it’s those relationships we foster, in the blue-sky days, that will decide whether we will be successful in the gray sky day. And I think so much of what we do in emergency management is so much rather relational, and being able to coordinate and collaborate to cooperate with folks and that that whether your degree whether your background, is formal education or not, whether your background is in poly sci fi, or science or

art, if you if you still have the interest in serving during times of emergency, and realize that to be able to do that you’ve got to serve during the times of peace, or blue skies, then regardless of where your background comes from, you can be successful in this field,

Irene Conforti  11:59 

I think it’s very, really interesting, sort of the point that you’re bringing up about the soft skills, that that are not something that you can acquire in an online degree program, but the skill of being able to maintain those connections, and then also connecting and collaborating with other individuals and saying, Oh, you know, you’re working in in such a field, I know, somewhat so and so who’s able to, you know, maybe provide some insight on that, or they’ve done some really great research, let me connect you with them. And having those partners is a liaison job that every emergency manager must be able to succeed in. But it’s not necessarily. Like you said, it’s not the plans, procedures and protocols. So, I think I’m, I might adopt that thing that 5149 about relationships, because I think, you know, one really informs the other in being able to say, Hey, you know, I know that you’ve got a memorandum of understanding, how did you guys put that together? You know, what do you suggest that I do for my community? Because I think those are, you know, some really great examples of, of why relationships are so important in the soft skills are important for emergency management. And I know that you’re currently working, you know, you’ve always been doing, sir, sort of paramedic work. And I know that that is a huge a huge field, in and of itself, including emergency management, but it its own beast, and then I know that you’re doing public health emergency management preparedness, I’d love to have you speak a little bit about that.

Jody Carter  13:52 

So, I do partner with our public health partners a lot. I generally whatever I think at least here in within Arkansas, whenever we think public health, it’s probably more in the government sector with our county health units, our local health units, as well as our state health department. I’m working in kind of an offshoot of public health, more health care, emergency management, with hospitals, we’ve got some wonderful public health partners and in our wonderful Public Health Partners understand, especially the governmental side and grant applications and grant management substantially more than I do. And I’m glad for all the work that our public health partners do. Here, here where I’m at I work for Baptist Health, we’re a think we’re the state’s largest healthcare provider. We’ve got 11 hospitals across the state. And I don’t know how many clinics we’ve got. We’ve got a handful of imaging centers, and 14 rural health clinics and a bunch of doctors’ offices and five hospice own home health entities, we have a pace, which is an all-inclusive care for the elderly. We have a retirement village that includes a nursing home and assisted living and independent living and an Alzheimer’s unit. And somewhere around I believe, 16,000 employees across the state. And primarily, our department focuses on the emergency preparedness for our hospitals. We also do some consultative work for some of our non-hospital entities. And we’re heavily driven by CMS, which is the Center for Medicare, Medicaid services, Medicare, Medicaid pay a lot of our bills. And the way CMS works is, is they have Conditions of Participation and we must meet these conditions to get reimbursed for the care that our wonderful health care providers give our patients. And

one of those conditions that came out a couple years ago, one of those conditions that we must meet is about emergency management. And CMS about two years ago came out with an emergency preparedness rule. And part of the rule is if you don’t do these things, have a have an emergency plan, have a hazard analysis, do exercises every year train your people have plans, if you don’t do these, these key core emergency management processes, it puts it risk your ability to get reimbursed for the health care that your clinical site is providing. We’re also driven and guided by some of our accrediting bodies, we’ve got some of our hospitals that are accredited by the Joint Commission, formerly called Jake coats now the Joint Commission. And then we’ve got a couple of facilities that are accredited by another accrediting body called car they do they focus on rehab facilities. And then our hospital in addition to CMS and the accrediting bodies with also have a licensed by the hospital is licensed by the state. And so, we have state licensure requirements to meet for emergency management, our hospitals, almost all our hospitals also participate in our state trauma program. And our state trauma program requires that we have some emergency management components. And so, a lot of what we do in healthcare me is, is guided by what we must do when the check marks that we must check. But then there’s the other side of that same coin that we can’t ignore. And the other side of that same coin is we have an obligation to the communities that we serve, to be ready in times of crisis. And regardless of what the people who may pay the bills, say we must do. And regardless of what the accrediting or licensure bodies say we have to do, which are all very important, and we want to comply with, let’s make that clear that regardless of those requirements, we still have that moral and ethical obligation to serve the communities and in a lot of the communities that we have facilities were the only Hospital in the county, or they were the only Hospital in a maybe two or three County area, and we’ve got an obligation to be there to be prepared, and to be able to care for them in times of crisis.

Irene Conforti  18:24 

That’s, that’s true. And I can understand sort of the administrative aspects of the hospital and healthcare emergency management. And then I can I can also understand, you know, saying, hey, if, if we have to, you know, we want to make sure that we’re incredibly prepared for some of those gray sky days, in disaster and catastrophe incidents as well, we want to make sure that those events we are covered it prepared for and it’s not just, you know, check such and such a box, but, you know, the, the practical situation of being able to respond and serve the community and it sounds like, you know, in Arkansas, you are, you know, really serving the whole community. You know, whether it be you know, different age needs different abilities in access and functional needs. In really the health care sector touches everyone. You know, it’s such a such an important part, I guess what, one question that I have is what do you want emergency managers or students of emergency management to know and understand about hospital and healthcare emergency management that isn’t currently general knowledge? And, you know, what, what would you want a student of emergency management to know about the work that you’re doing?

Jody Carter  19:59 

I think I think so. I had been fortunate enough over the last several years to have hosted interns from a variety of different educational facilities and visiting with students and new practitioners in the field.

I think one opportunity that that a lot of our up and coming, especially those that are pursuing a formal education is to understand the intricacies of exercise to design and execution. Oddly enough, it’s exercise design and execution. And, and sometimes we must, we don’t have the luxury in healthcare. Sometimes we don’t have the luxury of having months to plan months or years to plan exercises, right? Sometimes we’ve got to pull drills off with days or weeks of notice. And, you know, talking with different people over the last several years that I’ve been here, and colleagues who work in other professions, sometimes they’ve got the luxury of, of having months or a year, year and a half to plan large exercises that are multi-jurisdictional and, and that will involve multiple moving parts at the same time. Whereas sometimes, a lot of times in healthcare, we don’t have that luxury of having month to plan such an exercise where we’re working right now on an evacuation drill with one of our rehab hospitals. And I think we’re doing it with two weeks’ notice, I believe we’re doing an evacuation drill for rehab hospital. And from initial contact to execution, I think it’s going to be two weeks. And according to some of the formal education and some of the guidance that will get, you know that that should take months to plan ran from, hey, we’ve got to do an evacuation drill, let’s go ahead and knock it out sometime in the next few months.

Looking at our calendars and saying, Well, if we can do it here or here, then that would be best and going ahead and agreeing with your administrators to do it in the next few weeks. that it works for us. And we’ve got a strong team of experienced Emergency Management practitioners who can do that. And that’s probably one that I have noticed Irene over the last several years is, is folks understanding, sometimes we don’t have the luxury to have an initial a middle and a final planning committee meeting. And sometimes we can’t always do super long situation manual, sometimes, honestly, most of my exercise plans are half a page long. Whenever I put these in front of administrators to get their buy in and to convince them to participate, I don’t have time to put a 20 20-pageplan in front of them. Right, I’ve got to have a half page x plan that explains why we must do it and what we’re going to do and what objectives we’re getting to and get that knocked out and in one piece of paper. And that’s been the challenge that I’ve had overcome and, and that a lot of newer practitioners, I think have great opportunity to understand.

Irene Conforti  23:43 

Right, and when, you know, I I’ve I am each certified and I’ve gone through that training. And I know that there’s a huge portion of exercise is also includes not only, you know, the evaluation and improvement planning piece, but also, you know, that there’s a training aspect that, you know, there’s a lot of research that suggests that having a training, you know, prior to an exercise really helps to hammer home the idea. The idea is that we’re you’re looking for it helps to increase evaluation scores, and then you’re able to evaluate, you know, against what you’ve trained on. So, and I know that you’ve done some training as well. I guess I’m wondering what types of trainings or education is there an overlap between the hospital emergency management or the healthcare emergency management and emergency management in a in a local jurisdictional situation?

Jody Carter  24:52 

Do you mean training I’ve taken or training I’ve conducted in house?

Irene Conforti  24:55 

Both.

Jody Carter  24:58 

So, training in house, because we’re geographically spread out and we’ve got so many people working so many shifts, and so many different locations across our state. corporately we’ve adopted a lot of computer-based learning to deliver our standardized material that we’ve got to get out about to everybody, we rely heavily on computer-based learning or the acronym CBl computer-based learning is our in-house acronym, but we rely on that heavily.

I don’t know what the analytics would show on information retention from that, from that. I love teaching. And in there, there are some of those topics that that require a hands-on component. And I’m fortunate to have a fantastic training and exercise coordinator that works alongside me, and we get a lot of requests, we have an evacuation device it’s a foldable roll able of sled. It’s a big plastic sheet, we can put patients on and lower them down stairwells. And we had a lot of requests for hands on in services with staff on how to use this sled and, and so we do a lot of hands on in services with that, in fact, that exercise that the rehab facility evacuation drill we’re going to do here soon, is going to include a sled component because we’ve been training on it, we’re going to include that component in our drill, to test our level of experience and comfort and identify additional training opportunities.

And I’ll tell you on the training that I go to, and that I attend.

We’ve got some fantastic partners here across the state of Arkansas that that

get some grant funding, some federal grant funding, and we we’ve had some wonderful training, training conferences, training seminars offered over the last several years. In fact, I was at a two-day training just last week, and we had we had some healthcare administration representatives from the East Coast that had to do some healthcare facility evacuations and during a hurricane in they came and talked about what they learned from having to evacuate their facilities. And then we had a physician who led an evacuation of a hospital out west here in some wildfires. And we had the emergency manager of a hospital that has received victims from two different large active shooting situations. And

a lot of what I’m learning these days, kind of goes back to that whole 5149 concept I talked about earlier in relationships and from a conference a few years ago, I was able to exchange business cards and professionally get to know healthcare emergency manager out east to whose hospital received the victims of a large shooting several years ago, and we’ve talked about mass casualty reception and what that means for us and, and bounced ideas off each other. And when I say bounce ideas off each other, I mean, he’s been teaching me a lot. I don’t know if I’ve reciprocated in this relationship very much. But he has taught me a lot from his unfortunate experience. And so, a lot of a lot of what I’m I don’t know, maybe in the middle of my career, I don’t know where I’m at in my career, I guess I’m in the middle of it, but

so much of it, I think goes back to that 5149 and, and who you know and who you’re able to call upon and what experts do, you know, I’ll tell you.

I sometimes describe myself as an out of work ambulance driver. And I know a whole bunch of my EMT and paramedic colleagues just cringed at me saying that. But sometimes I say that’s all I am. And I don’t know a whole lot. But I know a lot of smart people and I can get them on the phone quick. And so much of what I’m learning over and over. And even at this conference last week Irene just kind of reinforces that, that networking, the importance of networking, and who you who you can get to know and the relationships that you’re able to foster and how you can help them and how they can help you. And it’s got to be a mutual symbiotic relationship going both directions. But that’s so much of what I’m learning these days, yeah, there’s some there’s some technical stuff, and I’m learning some, some technical on how to evacuate a hospital. And, oh, there was a, we use an electronic medical record system here within our health system. And I just learned last week that there is a very specific report that it can run that, that I didn’t know about, and it’d be a very helpful report to get to have. And so again, I you know, there’s some technical knowledge that I’m picking up, and that’s good to have. But so much of its just reinforced, re enforcing that relationship whole component that we kind of talked about earlier, man.

Irene Conforti  30:02 

Right. And I think that you, you raise a great point that, you know, so much of emergency management does focus on certifications, which are important. And, you know, there are a lot of computer-based learning, like the independent study courses for FEMA, on EMI his website, in those technical types of courses that are in person trainings as well. But you know, you’re right, that you can learn so much, from colleagues who are in similar positions, and it may be experienced different types of disasters or who have, you know, gone through unique experiences and having those connections, and learning from them is invaluable. And you’re never going to get a certification that says, hey, you know, I’ve, I’ve spoken to my colleagues and I know a lot about their experiences, but I think that it’s a worthwhile venture, you know, you know, connect with them. And, like you said, learn from them and have lessons learned from some of those, you know, really, you know, tragic situations like mass casualties. And in shooting incidents, that that makes sense. And it’s,

it’s, it’s something that I think that most of the emergency managers that I’ve met, have a lifelong learning attitude, they’re always interested in learning, they are always interested in training. And it’s, you know, using the best tools for the job

is something that emergency managers generally are interested in.

So, I guess I’m wondering, how did you get from

chemistry to emergency management? And how, how do you envision the future of emergency management? Looking like in the future?

Jody Carter  32:02 

Oh, wow. So, Wow, good questions. There a couple of good hard questions. So, we’ll talk a little bit about chemistry to emergency management and how did that work out and, and then that don’t let me forget about the future of emergency management because I’ll probably pontificate for several minutes on that as I as I try to collect my thoughts, but let’s, you know, getting the chemistry degree. I was doing that as a pre-med major thinking I want to go to medical school. And then the university I was at the undergrad I went to Henderson State University in ARCA Delphia Arkansas. And they offered an EMT paramedic program and I had a scholarship, I had a full paid academic scholarship for undergrad that I was fortunate to receive. And one of the requirements was to maintain a certain grade point. And especially as I was getting into my junior, and particularly my senior level of undergrad, some of those higher-level chemistry and math courses were really challenging me. And so, thinking I was, well being pre-med at the time with a with an intent to go to medical school, I saw that EMT paramedic program. And I thought, Well, hey, one that might give me a leg up getting into medical school. But also, that might be some hours to help pad my great point a little bit. And so, I enrolled in the EMT, and then subsequently, the paramedic program, using my scholarship to help get into grad school and at the same time,

kind of helped my grade point a little bit survived some of those senior level chemistry courses that I passed by the skin of my teeth that I had always wanted to be an emergency room physician ever since I can, oh, probably ever Middle School, through my high school years. But probably even as far back as a seventh, seventh or eighth grade, I’d wanted to be an emergency room physician. And so then through college, your premed with, with that whole paramedic thing, and then then I had the chemistry degree into work as a chemist for a few years to help pay the bills, because the MS doesn’t do that. And

so then, you know, nights and weekends still on an ambulance, and occasionally on a big red fire truck. And

from there doing the Homeland Security thing and finding an online Emergency Management Program, quite frankly, just kind of seemed to all fit, you know, the desire to do emergency medicine and some response background, and then some Homeland Security work that I learned a whole lot from that federally subsidized training program I worked for getting to work and learn there and then and then enjoy my wonderful grad school experience at Jacksonville State. So, it just kind of all seemed to flow and you know, I have people who say to me, so as an emergency manager, that means you’re a professional warrior, right? And it means that your job is to sit up at night and dream up worst case scenarios. So, you you’re a professional worrier, aren’t you and I said you know, I’m not because

of our hazard vulnerability analysis and doing an HBA and Irene I like to think that I bring my chemistry background into the conduct of our HIV AIDS every year, because I’m able to take a bit of a more analytical stance on it. And, and as we look at the probability of our different threats and, and our levels of preparedness, and just what the impacts will be, and as we, we, we use the Kaiser Permanente model, we started with the Kp model for our hazard analysis here at Baptist and, and then we’ve kind of tweaked them a little bit. But I was able in the tweaking, I was able to bring that analytical background from my chemistry degree to bear and was able to say, look, let’s get some good historical data, you know, my, my crystal ball to see the future is a little fuzzy, and I’m not very good at it. But if you have the right information, you can you can investigate the past rather well. And so, if we want to know what the probability of a certain threat impacting our facility is, Well, then let’s go back and let’s look at the last 20 years. And let’s see how many times we’ve experienced that that possibility come to fruition and rank it accordingly on our HBA. And, and so I bring that analytical side of it to the emergency management field. And so, I don’t have to be professional warrior, I’m able, I’m able analytically to determine what do I really need to fear and what do I not

let that guide me.

Irene Conforti  36:51 

I knew that you mentioned you’re right about that, that I don’t know any emergency manager who’s in a professional warrior. I do know somebody professional planners, and are, you know, good at planning and preparing.

But I know that you mentioned the Kaiser Permanente

it was it a hazard risk analysis. I haven’t heard about that. And I’d love to hear more.

Jody Carter  37:20 

So, Kaiser Permanente, and you must excuse me for not knowing that the formal history of their model. But Kp came out several years ago, many possibly decades ago, Kp Kaiser Permanente came out with a model of conducting a hazard analysis into

to simplify it a little bit just since we’re doing this audibly, and I don’t have a whiteboard to demonstrate with.

Make, in your mind, make four columns. In column one, we’re going to list every possible threat that we can come up with. I’ve done it on four different pages. page one is natural hazards like tornadoes and earthquakes and forest fires. Number two is manmade, which are things like the power outage generator failure. Number three

is hazmat. So internal, external spills. And then number four, I believe my fourth page was more terrorism related to bomb threats and

kidnappings,

active shooters, and even some Seaborn risks, but so, so anyway, however long we’ve got for most of our hospitals are hazard analyses, look at like 50 different threats 50 or 60, different threats. So, so anyway, but column one you risk, you list all your threats, call them to you give it a score, from we use a one through five, you give it a score one to five of how probable it is. So, one means essentially a once in a lifetime event and five means it occurs at least once a year. Okay, so that’s, that’s your second console. Number one is a list of threats. Number two, second column is your probability on a scale of one to five? column number three, is the impact. So how bad will it be? Now we take that second column or that third column, the impact column, and we divide that we sub divide that into some sub columns, and we look at how will impact people so number of illnesses, injuries or deaths, we look at how it will impact our buildings. And then we look at from a business impact, what will it mean to our business case? And so that’s your third column, then you can subdivide these if you’d like, but that’s your third column is impact or how bad will it be from a scale of one to five, then your fourth column is your level of readiness. If you want to be subdivided into the different phases of EM, you can do that. But what are your levels of readiness on a scale of one to five and then Kp, put a Kaiser Permanente put a formula together, it’s a relatively simple formula, they put a formula together, that then gives you a percentage yield at the end. And the higher the percentage, the bigger of a risk it is. And when it’s all said and done, I said it was four columns, it’s five, your fifth column is your score. So, five columns, the hazards, the risk, the level of impact, your level of readiness, and then column five is the overall score.

And then you take all those scores, and you sort on and whatever top 10 scores you got, those are your top five or 10 threats that you need worry about 10. And so, you know, zombie apocalypse is probably going to end up very low.

out

out in the West Coast, earthquake, or a wildfire will probably rank very high. And so that’s, that’s the Kaiser Permanente model of doing a hazard vulnerability analysis or an HBA. There are other models out there, I’ve seen them. The Kp model is the one that that I’ve just kind of always used and uncomfortable with. And so that’s the one that I’ve historically kind of gravitated towards.

Irene Conforti  41:36 

Well, I really appreciate you taking the time to explain that that’s sounds like a useful tool, you know, not only for hospitals, but it seems like it could have a wider application, you know, for hazard, and threat analysis. So that is great. Thank you very much God for explaining that. And I will just ask one last question before I let you go about what you envision for the future of our profession, and what you envision for the future of healthcare and hospital emergency management as well.

Jody Carter  42:17 

Yeah, so

I think our jobs are relatively secure.

I think that we are seeing more and more opportunities for emergency managers to gain experience, whether its man made or natural.

I’m also hoping that there are additional paid professional opportunities that open up

spatially not on the coasts. So, I think I think the coast, both the left and the right coast, the US have some strong Emergency Management opportunities. I think in the middle of the country, I think, I think some folks call us the flyover states. But I think in the middle of the century, I think there’s some opportunities for professional emergency managers to really show why our profession is important. And I hope that there will be additional professional opportunities opened up not just in the public sector, but also in the private, I’ve got to say, I’m really appreciative of the opportunities that I’ve been afforded here at Baptist Health and, and the vision that they’ve got for emergency management and the heart that my administration has, and my ability to do what I’m what I do, and I think our future is strong, I think our profession is relatively young, you know, our profession is probably 30 or 40 years old, I think we’ve been coming to our own within the last 10 or 15. You know,

we don’t have the longevity that that some career fields have, you know, I like to joke that firefighters were invented five minutes after man discovered fire, and emergency management, you know, we’re only in the, you know, 30 or 40 years old as a profession. And, and I think the number of universities and colleges that are starting to realize the educational market is growing. And I’m glad to see that. I’m glad to see that there are so many folks that can learn through an asynchronous modality, online. And as they’re able to

advance their careers and get experience practically, they’re also able to spend time, formerly gaining and education. I’m appreciative for our focus center doing Emergency Management research, and that are focusing on the profession. I’m appreciative for the International Association of emergency managers and the work that that I am does, and the National Emergency Management Association also does great work but

connected with I am and, and have been

appreciative for the work and the research and the guidance that they provide as well. And I think our future is strong. And I think we’re coming about I think folks have some real good hands on opportunities. And at the same time, I think we’ve got we’ve got a place for academia and formal research. And I think where the rubber meets the road is where you’re able to find folks that have a little bit of all of it and can put it into practical motion. Whenever those gray skies do come about?

Irene Conforti  45:55 

Well, I really appreciate having you on the program, is there any advice that you would give students of emergency management?

Jody Carter  46:03 

Yeah, the last, the last insight that I would give.

When it comes to emergency management, there’s lots of opportunities, 24/7, 365.

And if we’re going to survive, and I don’t mean we as a profession, but I mean, we as the individual practitioners, if we’re going to survive long, we’ve got to take care of ourselves too. And I think maintaining a balanced work life balance, a healthy work life balance, I think the understanding that a good Emergency Management Program is not contingent upon your presence. There, you know, this, this last weekend, it was Easter weekend of 2019. Me, me and my wife had some had some plans this weekend that we had been looking forward to, and, and I let my boss I took Friday off and we had weekend plans, and I let my boss know, hey, I’m the emergency management guy, but I’m taking the weekend off, and I’m not available. And if something happens, you’re going to have to handle it. And fortunately, enough, we’ve hopefully developed our program to the point where there’s redundancies and people are trained on what they can do, and it’s not contingent upon my presence, you know, I would hope that things would go a little better because I’m there but quite frankly, a truly well.

well-designed emergency management programs, not contingent on my presence.

Irene Conforti  47:37 

A good point about you know, mental health and about your work life balance and understanding, sort of when to be able to turn the cell phone off and when to be able to engage and connect with your colleagues. And I think that you’re right, that that’s really great advice to have everyone you know, in the emerging management profession, but also in in any other profession, sort of, you know, going into their career just understanding you know, when work is on when work is off and being able to value the time you have with your family. So, and at the same time Irene sometimes having to know when to turn it on, and which brings up an interesting message I just got on my cell phone, and I’m going to have to thank you for this opportunity. And, and say let’s connect by email moving forward and maybe do some more sessions

Jody Carter  48:32 

when I but I have I’ve received a message that I need to go into.

Irene Conforti  48:36 

All right. Well, Jody, I really appreciate having you on the program. And I hope you have a great day. Thank you so much. And

Jody Carter  48:42 

Fantastic. Thanks, ma’am.

Irene Conforti  48:43  All right. Bye bye.

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